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Lasalle
Jul 31, 2018 16:30:33 GMT
via mobile
Post by dgp1957 on Jul 31, 2018 16:30:33 GMT
Brit battalion sizes 30 or 40 figs Brit line cavalry 24 or 32 figs
Russian battalion musketeer 24 or 32 figs Russian heavy cav 30 or 35 figs
Prussian musketeer 32 figs Prussian line cavalry 28 or 32 figs.
French line 36 or 45 figs French line cavalry 24, 28 or 32 figs.
There are a lot more troop type but these give you an idea of the unit sizes for Gdeb.
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Post by meliadus on Jul 31, 2018 17:36:20 GMT
hmm we can get away wi the inf sizes but the cav are massive, sad to say.
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Post by dandare on Aug 1, 2018 8:17:12 GMT
I like Lasalle- I had a look at Alan's link, and there are a number of suggestions there which are worth exploring. I liked the idea of a: columns of any kind cannot fire- this is realistic- if you want to fire, you deploy in line b: lines being charged fire with double dice in the reaction phase. If this is too powerful, then require a disc test ? (with the possible exceptioon of British/KGL?)
Thus 2 French columns charge a line. In the reaction phase, the line fires with 8 dice, needing 4s. it can concentrate it's fire, or it can split the dice as per the rules.
I suspect this might restore play balance without pushing it too far the other way. Otherwise the rules work very well
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Post by dandare on Aug 1, 2018 8:55:31 GMT
We have actually come up against the eternal wargaming conundrum:- historically, FRENCH columns usually beat lines, except when they came up against BRITISH/PORTUGUESE/KGL, when they invariably were stopped short by close range volleys.
Th real problem lies that wargamers know this- Napoleonic generals did not. If you write a set of rules which exactly replicates the conditions above, then there is little point in playing the game, as the result of infantry combat is pre-ordained.
The old WRG "Ball and Flag " rules had a rule which said that columns could not charge unshaken lines commanded by a British or KGL general. Conversely, if I remember, other lines became shaken when charged by French columns.
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Post by meliadus on Aug 1, 2018 10:15:41 GMT
I had a look at the link, the only thing i thought might do it, and if we do implement any of them its only one, not a whole bunch of them, I thought the the one where each column going in takes undivided fire from the line instead of splitting the fire up between them.
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Post by dandare on Aug 1, 2018 12:27:49 GMT
That would only inflict a maximum of 1 Disr on each column, Bob. Rolling 8 dice against a single column gives a sporting chance of 2. Can I suggest we try out some options a week on Sunday?
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Post by dandare on Aug 1, 2018 12:34:26 GMT
and then again, in the first set of rules I played, you had to calculate "flinch points"- again a WRG set.
On the miniatures page someone has listed over 300 sets of Napoleoonic rules.
I've played: WRG WRG ball and flag Empire III Corps d'Armee Airfix Napoleonic Eaglebearer (electronic) Black Powder Lasalle TTG Napoleonic Charge! Lasalle Shako
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Lasalle
Aug 1, 2018 13:16:32 GMT
via mobile
Post by dgp1957 on Aug 1, 2018 13:16:32 GMT
Hi guys, I take the discussion is regarding one brit line vs 2 attack columns, how do the rules handle 1 vs 1? Also how would they handle 2 units in line vs 2 attack columns?
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Post by dandare on Aug 1, 2018 14:51:42 GMT
1 vs 1 is more even. The problem is apparently well known in Lasalle circles - units in attack column can gang up in a single unit in line- their firepower is the same, and they get twice as many close combat dice.
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Post by Zhao Zilong on Aug 1, 2018 15:08:46 GMT
It's the fact that the Attack Column is exactly half the width of a Line, so lining up two to hit a line is pretty straightforward - when in actuality the columns wouldn't operate that close together since they need the room to form line, and they were larger than 1/2 the frontage so it wouldn't work out that way.
It seems odd to me that to defend a position you would be better forming attack columns adjacent to each other than being in line.
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Post by dgp1957 on Aug 1, 2018 15:45:55 GMT
So if there were 2 units in line Vs 2 columns, that would be more even? If the 2 columns attack the one line, would it not allow the second line to attack the columns. What if the second line was behind the first line, would that not allow the second line to fight 2 columns with disruptions on them?
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Post by meliadus on Aug 1, 2018 17:22:21 GMT
Like yourself Don I do like Lasalle, but without making te line to op, I can't see what else we can do, yeah we can try some things aweek on sunday, and we'll try some this sunday.
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Post by meliadus on Aug 1, 2018 17:32:04 GMT
Alan, do you have napoleons battles ??
Because I've just found mine....
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Post by Zhao Zilong on Aug 1, 2018 22:33:54 GMT
Napoleon's Battles is a good set, but since it's for doing the large battles it looks a bit odd with 28mm figures.
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Post by meliadus on Aug 2, 2018 10:33:04 GMT
Was reading thro the rules, and they do look as if they might be the solution. If you want we could give them a try on Sunday, see how they feel ??
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